Topic on Talk:Guilty Gear/Characters/XX

In XX, Bridget was referred to and identified yourself as a male. That is it. End point. When a character is transsexual this doesn't sent a temporal ripple making him a character of that gender across all space and time. This is erasing history, erasing data, and that isn't good for a place which is supposed to record it.

I'm not making a similar topic on Tropedia because apparently Fandom is outrageously picky about this(I can't even spell nigga when writing song lyrics on rap encyclopedias on that place despite the fact it's encyclopedias which should be uncensored, something not even Wikipedia at its worst does).

In other words, do not create continuity issues. You're free to call Bridget a her in Strive entries.

I'm not saying this because of politics, I'm just trying to avert mind-screwing continuity issues.

So nice of you to unilaterally declare Wiki Policy, thoughtfully sparing the Admin Staff the trouble.

We've warned you about your aggressive attitude regarding what other users contribute to articles. I personally know of at least one user whom you seem to have convinced that you were a wiki mod, when you most expressly are not. This kind of message is yet another instance of you attempting to impersonate a member of the moderation staff by making what appears to be a statement of wiki policy while having absolutely no authority to do so.

Per bullet point 9 of section 2.3 of How We Do Bans Around Here, this is your official warning -- you do not get to declare policy, you do not get to tell other users what they may or may not do when editing an article. Do it again, and you get a tempban.

Everyone else reading this, feel free to add whatever you think is appropriate. Horny here has no power to stop you or punish you for anything you edit, and if he attempts to bully you about it, report him to the mod staff. Assuming we don't see it on our own.

-- Looney Toons, admin

@Labster @Looney Toons @GethN7 @Robkelk @QuestionableSanity @Derivative @SelfCloak

Everyone else reading this, feel free to add whatever you think is appropriate. Horny here has no power to stop you or punish you for anything you edit, and if he attempts to bully you about it, report him to the mod staff

Because he was reported to the mod staff for just such behaviour, HornyLikeIAmA14YearOldGirl has received a tempban. They have also lost their autopatrolled rights and will have to re-earn those rights.

I see that HornyLikeIAmA14YearOldGirl also removed a trope without explanation while making his update. I've restored that trope. I've also changed the redlink that HornyLikeIAmA14YearOldGirl added to point to the actual name of the trope.

I trust that fixing things that were broken does not count as being "smart", whatever that's supposed to mean. (I come from a culture that values intelligence, so I don't see any reason to use the word ironically.)

For the record: His Japanese profile for the new game is quite clear that Bridget was and is still male. Anything to the contrary has been shown to be a translation change, either a mistranslation or deliberate plot change on the part of the western release.

edit: Link to official website. It's unambiguous. Bridget's sex is "隠され" ("hidden", "disguised"), and "自分が男として生き" is pretty clear he's male too.

On this topic, as Agiletek put it, this is clearly a localizer specific issue, but with that in mind, Horny, chill your jets. I think this change is an asinine retcon personally, being a fan of the Guilty Gear series myself (not to mention the Western localization contains what amounts to disturbing implications Bridget having been emotionally abused into accepting a female identity), but keep your seethe under control, I find it stupid, but it was the choice of the localizers for the Western versions, so we WILL mention it, that does not imply agenda on our part, just a statement of objective fact, we will also note the original translation as well.

Again, our role is to state objective fact and when we do allow stating opinion, we do so while keeping ourselves under control, not letting our personal biases leak venom into our discourse.

Sorry if I came out as angry or demanding, and I have no intention of creating policy. It is just I really dislike when people go back to a page referring after what happenned on a previous installment of a series and try to rewrite it, sometimes even excluding tropes to fit new information. To give you an example, pages on the Naruto character sheet were shook all around back when I was still on TVT because the story went back and forth about who Tobi really was. That still angers me because I'm very cautious about giving away spoilers or being overly cautious about spoilers.

Just because a change happened doesn't make tropes cease to exist. At least from my POV. The jokes about Johnny thinking he is hitting on a woman on XX and accidentally hitting on a man didn't became less of a joke.

About this specific fact, I had no idea there may have been a mistranslation and honestly I will sidestep this entirely from now on. I remember Justice being referred as male on the translation of the first game to English too.

Fair enough, glad we got that sorted out. What we'll do is acknowledge both the former and latter information, making clear Strive is when it changed. Regardless of the reason for the change, I agree we need to acknowledge reality, so we will note any discrepancies between former canon and later canon, but will do so calmly and dispassionately.

I think it's worth noting that apparently, Bridget only explicitly calls himself a girl in one of his three arcade endings... and the bad ending at that. Here's a look at his Arcade dialogue for reference. Not sure what this means for his gender identity or his treatment on this site as a whole but it gives off vibes that in the bad ending, Bridget gives up and conforms with society's expectations of who he is while his best ending has him be inspired to be his own man. Or at least, that's an increasingly popular interpretation people are walking away with.

...this doesn't seem like a "bad" ending, more of a "not-golden". But... hmm.

I've translated some japanese comments from Twitter and japanese sites and the fans seem to be treating Bridget the same way it was (as a boy) and are confused why this is a controversy overseas at all.

I'm well aware is a trope for feminine-looking young boys to pretend to be girls to unsuspecting men(or women) in japanese media. See Floren in Xenoblade 2.

Arc System Works NA seems to be avoiding using any third-person pronouns for Bridget at all.

I'm more on the side this is a joke that didn't translate well.

Considering what ATT has done with jokes that we inherited from TV Tropes, perhaps it should be removed altogether, maybe.

Well, if anyone has no further opinions, I think I will remove the "transsexual" trope and add clarifications about the ambiguity of the game's dialogue. STRIVE sold very well and is very likely to get a sequel on the same engine, so Bridget's presence there is ensured, so any further clarification will be there, though Ishiwatari is known for dodging questions(he dodged a similar question about Testament only a few months ago to make a joke).

Fair enough, that seems reasonable. Given this appears to be a translation difference in localizations and there is prior canon to support the assertion of such, that seems equitable to resolve this.

While looking further into the matter, I stumbled across this reddit thread with an email claiming Bridget's gender to not be canon.

...except it's apparently from customer support - why would they feel the need to weigh in on this, assuming this is an actual email? Is there doubt about what's been found in the game itself - because this doesn't seem like it would be needed if her being trans wasn't canon.

Update - both ARCSYS JP and EN confirmed the email was fake.

...and THIS specific comment chain in the thread I just linked points to a YouTube video of Bridget's ending scene in Japanese, with specific attention to the following line:

Bridget: Ojouchan de ii desu yo. Uchi wa... onna no ko desu kara!
"Ojouchan de" - Using "little lady"
"ii" - good/fine
"desu" - is
"yo" - Sentence ending particle used to mark a setence as containing information the recepient might not know or to add emphasis.
"Uchi" - A feminine version of "I"
"wa" sentence particle marking the preceding as the subject of the sentence
"onna no ko" - girl
"desu kara" - That's why/after all/because
There is no ambiguity here."

...followed by links to these three sites to support the idea.

From all outside appearances, this seems to confirm that Bridget unambiguously considers herself a girl - based on all available information Guilty Gear Strive doesn't have a "bad ending" - just different endings dependent on your performance during Arcade Mode and whether or not they were "flawless clears". While this is the only ending in which she says it outright, the other two endings can be read as alluding to the same or adding on to it - and if that all holds up, then the initial post in this thread seems to have been a serious misrepresentation of things in order to justify what appears to be personal preference.

Well... since there's no ambiguity in the text, anything that says there is should be removed. To quote GethN7, "our role is to state objective fact".

Exactly, which is why I find it profoundly irritating that TVTropes was invoked in order to - and stop me if I'm wrong here - deliberately obfuscate objective facts and try to get ahead of a "narrative" in order to push a different one.

Well then, I agree we should be objective, and since new information has come to light supporting this change, I shall not stand in the way of the truth.