Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy: Difference between revisions

 

It is often said that 'conflict is the soul of drama'; without some form of conflict to fuel things, there's no engine to drive the story and thus little reason to engage with it. However, we here at All The Tropes would like to propose an amendment to this phrase which includes something important but, sadly, all too often forgotten:

 

 

 

This is basically the emotional result of [[Shades of Conflict|Black And Black Morality]]. Because the conflict between the equal evils is essentially meaningless, there is no dramatic tension. Maybe one [[Eldritch Abomination]] eats you in a slightly less painful manner than the other one, but either way, you're still screwed. You can't support any factions or hold on to any ideals after this effect has set in. All you can do is sit agape as the writers apparently attempt to outdo themselves at making the setting [[It Got Worse|even worse and more unpleasant and more nihilistic]] to the point where the media is as monotone-miserable as [[Joy Division]]. This trope is not just about a [[World Half Empty]], but about [[Evil vs. Evil]] and [[Sliding Scale of Idealism Versus Cynicism|too much cynicism]] producing this effect.

 

 

When applying to individuals, this is basically one of the reasons why the "[[Wangst]]" trope happens.

If the hero of the story openly [[Lampshade Hanging|lampshades]] their ''own'' apathy toward the outcome of the story, they might be a [[Nominal Hero]].

 

 

* ''[[Ergo Proxy]]'' can, in its early stages, fall victim to this trope. Near the beginning of the series, there were a few moral dilemmas stemming from black and black morality. Stop the Proxy that's loose in Romdo and the fascist government regains total control over the city. Don't stop the Proxy and it'll continue a murder spree.

* By the end of ''[[Code Geass]]'', {{spoiler|a world war}} breaks out between two factions trying to create identical oppressive worldwide dictatorships. After this, the trope is subverted: {{spoiler|after Lelouch conquers the world, he oppresses it to make sure [[0% Approval Rating|every single person in it will hate him]], and then commits public [[Suicide by Cop]],}} ending the tyranny and marking the first step to world peace. {{spoiler|It was [[Thanatos Gambit|his plan]] all along}}.

** It's already going that way early in Season One; the very first episode features Lelouch mind-controlling a platoon of soldiers into suicide and [[What Measure Is a Mook?|doesn't seem at all moved]], and a few episodes later he {{spoiler|carries out an operation which involves sacrificing his own troops without their knowledge as well as endangering and killing numerous noncombatants}}, making it rather difficult to sympathize with the protagonist.

** This applies for the ''leaders'' of the two factions. But globally, ''Code Geass'' avoids this effect by having a lot of nice characters put in the middle of a war started by evil leaders.

* ''[[Desert Punk (manga)|Desert Punk]]'', albeit a comic series falls into this. Almost every single character is a massive [[Jerkass]], and the few exceptions never prosper in this world. By the middle of the series, it's quite clear that none of the three major characters have a [[Hidden Heart of Gold]]. Pretty much summing things up is the comment by the [[Lemony Narrator]] in the last episode in respect to the [[After the End]] setting, which is to the effect that "With people like this, it doesn't matter if humanity goes extinct."

* ''[[Black Lagoon]]'', especially in its early stages. The anime version tones it down a little.

* Done [[Narm Charm|beautifully]] in ''[[MD Geist]]''. Our [[Sociopathic Hero|hero]] '''really''' [[Not So Different|isn't any better]] than the [[Big Bad]] and eventually ''{{spoiler|releases the [[Zombie Apocalypse|Death Force]]}}'' simply because he knows how meaningless his life would be with out [[Blood Knight|something nasty to fight]].

* ''[[Naruto]]'': The battle between Sasuke and Itachi: one betrayed his village and sided with Orochimaru to obtain enough power to kill the other, while the other tortured and mindraped the former by ''killing their entire bloodline''. Oh, and joined [[Standard Evil Organization Squad|Akatsuki]].

** Though in all fairness, Itachi has been seriously hinted at as {{spoiler|not evil, given his interaction with Naruto just beforehand.}} Also, Sasuke isn't really a villain {{spoiler|yet}} due to him killing {{spoiler|Orochimaru, Deidara,}} and is trying to kill one of Konoha's most dangerous enemies. And the audience also hopes that, after killing Itachi, Sasuke can finally get better. {{spoiler|Of course, then comes [[The Reveal]], and then... well, things just go downhill from there.}}

* Season one of ''[[Hell Girl]]'' in particular can get a little ridiculous. Every episode, you're introduced to a new [[Complete Monster]] with no real objective other than to prove his/her guilt in as many obvious ways as possible. Even when they get what's coming to them, it's not before they've completely ruined someone, or many peoples lives, sometimes irrevocably. And you know the next episode is just gonna feature someone even crueler.

* ''[[Bakuman｡]]'' features this in-universe with the main characters' reactions to Nanamine's "Classroom of Truth," in which [[Kill'Em All|everyone]], [[The Hero Dies|including the main character]] [[Downer Ending|dies]], with Mashiro saying that having the main character's efforts turn out to be in vain doesn't work.

 

== Comic Books ==

* This is the most common criticism about the post-[[Civil War (Comic Book)|Civil War]] [[Marvel Universe]]. The heroes are written as being horrible people at the very least, and no matter who wins the [[Crisis Crossover]], [[It Got Worse|it only gets worse.]]

* ''[[Wanted (Comic Book)|Wanted]]''. In a fight between a group of nihilistic, mass-murdering, serial-raping assholes who want to continue ruling the world in secret and a group of nihilistic, mass-murdering, serial-raping assholes who want to rule the world openly, why should the reader really care who wins? Heck, you might as well root for the series' antagonist, Mr. Rictus. At least ''he's'' good for some [[Black Comedy]] (literally; it's that kind of comic).

* ''[[Justice League of America|Justice League: The Rise of Arsenal]]'' was responsible for destroying [[Green Arrow|Roy Harper's]] character following his dismemberment at the hands of Prometheus and the death of his daughter in ''[[Cry for Justice]]''. On the one side there is Roy, reeling from the loss of his only child, grappling with the fact that he may no longer be able to use a bow and arrow, and suffering from impotency and hallucinations (whose source was not clarified as stemming from grief, pain medication, or his infected right arm). He lashes out at his friends and family for trying to help, begins stealing pain killers from Dr. Mid-Nite, goes back on heroin, and turns into a murderous anti-hero after being goaded into killing Prometheus's ally the Electrocutioner (by a hallucination of Lian) then burning down his home. However, on the other side, his friends and family truly don't help the situation that much. They don't seem to have fully understood just what Roy has lost. Dr. Mid-Nite was completely oblivious to the fact that Roy was stealing pain killers, quite easily in fact. Cyborg designed him a shoddy mechanical arm meant to work around the infected nerve endings in Roy's arm, while simultaneously enhancing his pain and limiting whatever abilities as an archer he had left. [[The Flash|Wally West]] does absolutely nothing to help, [[Wonder Woman|Donna Troy]] stops after Roy accuses her of "whoring around in space with Kyle Rayner" while her husband and son died in a car crash. Though, someone who's gone through everything Donna has should've understood Roy's suffering a little easier. And [[Nightwing|Dick Grayson]] consigns to have Roy locked in a substance abuse center for super villains after he has a vivid hallucination while on heroin. Dick does so with the consent of [[Black Canary]], who washes her hands of Roy and considers him a lost cause. It's hard to root for Roy when he's acting like such an asshole, but given that his family and friends treat his loss with such negligence, it's hard to side with anyone in this comic.

 

* Some readers think that ''[[Code Geass Megiddo]]'' is heading this way.

** Starfire runs right into Herb of the Musk, {{spoiler|who is so dedicated to [[Just Following Orders]] that despite realizing that she's desperately trying ''not'' to kill him, he just uses her hesitation to [[Curb Stomp Battle|casually beat her unconscious]]. X-COM then [[Mind Rape]]s her and almost ''[[They Would Cut You Up|vivisects]]'' her. Only the appearance of the other Titans proves her a non-combatant(due to being more subtly Mind Raped), which leads them to instead draft her without a second thought and imprison her in an environment that browbeats her with UN legislature that [[Inhumanable Alien Rights|aliens have no rights]], and she's ''not'' an exception.}}

** Jinx makes a friend for the first time since she left both the HIVE Academy and the Titans, {{spoiler|a rogue alien clone of Akari Unryuu, only for X-COM to accidentally-on-purpose return her to alien control so they can [[Playing with Syringes|experiment on her.]]}}

** Cyborg gets it the lightest - his courageous superhero act is mocked by X-COM, who want him to [[Stay in the Kitchen|Stay In The Lab]] building superweapons.

*** All in all, you don't read the fic wondering what will happen to anyone from the [[X-COM (Video Game)|X-COMverse]], as it's mentioned multiple times that they will likely all die in the titular assault on Cydonia. They don't care if they live or die, or [[And Then What?|what happens to their civilization after they kill all the aliens]], [[Eight Deadly Words|so why should the reader?]] What you wonder is if Our Heroes the Teen Titans will make it out of the Waffen-XX dimension ''alive'', or if they'll even get to ''[[Dying as Yourself|die sane.]]''

 

== Films ==

** Of course, while it might be ''too'' horrifying to subject, say, a family to the events of a horror film, making potential victims unlikable and [[Rooting for the Empire|rooting for the monster]] are both [[Comically Missing the Point]] of horror. Why should you be scared of something you're actually hoping to happen?

* The third ''[[Pirates of the Caribbean]]'' movie had this problem, with ''everyone'' backstabbing each other and shifting alliances on a whim that it got hard to root for anyone by the end. Of course, such a thing should be expected, given that the protagonists are all pirates by this point, even Will and Elizabeth.

* The first ''[[Underworld (film)|Underworld]]''. The final battle is [[Fur Against Fang|werewolves versus vampires]], throughout a dark underground complex. Everybody's wearing similar black leather clothes, carrying similar weapons and fighting in extremely low light, and the audience hasn't received any clues to cheer for either side. Even if you wanted to pick a side to support, you'd never know who was who anyway.

* ''[[Law Abiding Citizen]]''; at least for more sensible viewers who're not cheering Clyde on after he's murdering attorneys, judges and lawyers indiscriminately. He's initially seen as sympathetic, because [[Complete Monster|Darby killed his wife, daughter and got away with it by paying off Clyde's attorney]], but after the aforementioned slaughter during the movie's second half? Not so much. Of course, the members of the justice system come off no better, as they're unilaterally portrayed as [[Straw Character|horrible individuals who could care less about enacting true justice than do stuff that only benefits them]]. Well, except for Cindy, {{spoiler|though she dies too}}. [[Evil Versus Evil|No side looks any better than the other near the film's end]]. Nick, very conspicuously, has ethical issues with his job. He's suppressed most of them by the [[Time Skip]], but Clyde brings them roaring back.

* ''[[The Wrestler]]'' has this in spades. The main character is a self-centred, drug addled, has-been deadbeat father trying to cling onto his glory days while being way past his prime. The entire film is showing how much his life sucks up until he gets to have one last match, with him missing the chance to reconnect with his daughter due to being drugged up, nearly destroys his relationship with his stripper love interest because he gets drunk and insults her, and basically becomes so self destructive he destroys whatever was left of his physical health. {{spoiler|Then, he forces himself into an early grave by taking enough 'roids and crack to leave him near-death, and suffers a heart attack while wrestling.}}

* This could be the reason why ''[[Welcome to The Dollhouse]]'' and other films by Todd Solondz have never gotten much mainstream attention.

* ''[[The Breakfast Club]]'' can have this effect on more cynical viewers. The kids are a '''severely''' dysfunctional lot, and the adults are either apathetic or screwing the kids over [[For the Evulz|for no real reason]]. Arguably, the ''[[Neon Genesis Evangelion]]'' of John Hughes films.

 

== [[Interactive Fiction]] ==

* Adam Cadre's ''Varicella'' attempts to avert this by having its [[Villain Protagonist]], while still amoral and self-centered and willing to murder people to claim the Regency, not as evil as his rivals for the Regency, nearly all of whom are [[Complete Monster|truly horrible people]] who seem to enjoy their acts of abuse and [[Rape Is a Special Kind of Evil]]. But of course Varicella is still a short-sighted person who can't foresee {{spoiler|just how horrible things become when the prince takes the throne and becomes an even greater [[Complete Monster]]}}.

 

== Literature ==

* ''[[Hells Children]]'' by Andrew Boland, is this for most people.

* ''[[The Hunger Games (novel)|The Hunger Games]]'' seems like this at times, especially when {{spoiler|District 13's war tactics and overall militarism}} become morally questionable. Hell, forget {{spoiler|District 13}}, a lot of people find Katniss horrible enough that this happens.

** Some things to point out here. The first brother, Benjy, has severe autism and is essentially a child in an adult body. Anybody with autism and anybody who likes children ought to be able to identify with Benjy. The second brother, Quentin, does not really lust after his sister. He lied about it to his father because he was trying to protect her. He tries to be a good person, but he lives in a world that frankly does not care about his values. He self-destructs because he is unable to adapt to the standards of the world. Quentin is actually quite sympathetic. The third brother, Jason, is indisputably a [[Jerkass]]. However, his mother beat her nastiness into him. This could qualify him as a [[Jerkass Woobie]].

* While ''[[Blood and Chocolate]]'' is by many standards a good book, it suffers from this twice over. On a larger scale, [[Humans Are the Real Monsters]] who hate and fear werewolves, while werewolves sometimes provide ''very good reason'' why humans hate and fear them. On a smaller scale, any of seven or eight different characters, including the main character and both love interests, could be argued to be the most repulsive character in the book for one reason or another, and of the two characters who're most likeable one's a [[Straw Feminist]] who's not treated very seriously and the other gets eviscerated by a supposed friend. The silver lining is that the werewolf female lead and human primary love interest could balance each other out--{{spoiler|except that humans really ''can't'' trust werewolves, so he winds up trying to kill her.}}

* The works of [[Bret Easton Ellis]] can have that effect, as pretty much everyone in them is completely shallow, self-absorbed and stupid.

** Given that this is deliberate, you probably know what you're in for when you start one of his books.

* ''[[Malazan Book of the Fallen]]'' doesn't always do this, but it ''did'' creep up during ''Midnight Tides''. That novel depicts a war between the Tiste Edur (a nation that keeps humans as slaves and is ruled [[The Caligula|by an insane emperor]] who works for an [[Eldritch Abomination]]) and Letharas (a [[The Empire|brutal, expansionist empire]] that [[Straw Character|takes the flaws of capitalism as far as it can]] without being [[Played for Laughs]]). You can't even blame one side for being the ones to initiate the war, since they're both pretty eager for it even before the first blow is struck. Sure, individual characters on both sides of the conflict can be quite sympathetic, but the outcome of the war isn't that suspenseful, 'cause you know you're gonna wind up with a regime of violent, oppressive conquerors either way.

* Both 'sides' in [[Left Behind]] have exactly the same goals and use pretty much the same methods, [[Because Destiny Says So|everything that happens is part of God's plan]] and, as such, the characters have no free will and [[You Can't Fight Fate|nothing they do at any point in the series makes any difference whatsoever]], so it's really rather difficult to root for them.

* ''[[Dubliners]]'' by [[James Joyce]] is a book of short stories where every single one is about a disappointing, half-lived life that will probably end in isolation and ignominy. Hope spots are few and far between, and usually swiftly replaced by misery.

 

* This could very well be a reason ''[[Damages]]'' never got a wide audience. The main character often seems to lack a conscience, as do her competition.

** Pretty much the case for most FX Network shows: they mostly feature awful people doing awful things to each other. ''[[Nip Tuck]]'' was especially guilty of this, with the added bonus of graphic plastic surgery sequences.

* [[Soap Opera]]s and [[Teen Drama]]s often fall into a variant of the trope. Instead of all sides of the conflict being evil, [[Rule of Drama]] destroys all chance of lasting happiness. Thus, there is no point in rooting for a character you know is going to end up [[Trauma Conga Line|suffering]]. In soap operas, both sides of the conflict can end up being completely unsympathetic despite not being evil. The heroes are usually [[Too Dumb to Live]] [[Purity Sue|purity sues]]. The villains, while sometimes interesting, pick up the [[Idiot Ball]] a lot and have inconsistent motives.

* Ditto for ''[[Stargate Universe]]'', which was canceled soon after ''Caprica''.

* By the end of ''[[The Sopranos]]'', pretty much every character with dialogue has proven themselves to be pretty hideous excuses for human beings.

** HBO is famous for this, actually - ''[[Rome]]'' is full of ambitious, petty, and murderous "heroes"; ''[[Six Feet Under]]'' features characters who are not exactly evil, but tend to be so weak, neurotic, or just apathetic that the events of their lives are at least as doomed as anything in a [[Soap Opera]].

* [[Joss Whedon]]'s shows are sometimes in danger of falling into this, due to his [[True Art Is Angsty|happy people = boring television]] [[Signature Style]].

** By extension, ''[[Torchwood]]'', which Russell T Davies shall we say ''heavily'' based on the works of [[Joss Whedon]]. As [[That Guy With The Glasses|Welshy puts it]] Davies took [[Fun Personified|Captain Jack]] and [[Captain Ersatz|turned him into]] [[Angel]].

* ''[[The Practice]]''. At the beginning of the series, the attorneys are bright, fresh-faced and idealistic. By the end, they've completely sold out their standards and principles, end up representing drug dealers and undeniably guilty clients with money to keep the firm running, hire an anti-trust attorney who was fired from his previous job for embezzling money, and rely upon several questionable defenses (patriotism, doubt) in order to bolster their cases.

* ''[[Mad Men]]'' can get like this for some viewers. There's hardly a single character that isn't basically a selfish asshole.

* One of the reasons British historical dramas of the 1980s (like ''The Borgias'' and ''[[The Cleopatras]]'') flopped so badly was because they were trying to reproduce the success of ''[[I, Claudius]]''. But whereas ''[[I, Claudius]]'' had evil characters who were partly sympathetic and ''always'' entertaining to watch, the shows that came after it featured much weaker, less sympathetic villains. ''[[The Cleopatras]]'' was especially bad in this regard, as it was essentially a drama about horrible rulers murdering their equally horrible family members. If a character started out decent, there was a good chance he/she would be forcing their subjects into costly wars for their own selfish benefit and dismembering several of their own children by the time their story arc was over.

* One of the problems with the ''[[Gormenghast]]'' miniseries was that the most sympathetic, proactive character (Titus) didn't appear until well after it was underway. Those unfamiliar with the books might have been turned off by the endless, unsavory antics of a weird, menacing royal family and the [[Affably Evil]] man who was trying to exploit them. Only when Titus appeared did the audience really have someone to root for.

 

== [[Professional Wrestling]] ==

* Ignoring the insanity of [[Vince Russo]]'s endless use of the [[Shocking Swerve]], this trope was one of the main causes of [[WCW]]'s decline. While the [[New World Order|nWo]] [[Evil Is Cool|were cool]] for a while, they were '''the [[heel]]s''', which meant that they ultimately needed to lose, and lose completely. This, however, was a fact seemingly lost on everyone there (especially those members of the nWo who were involved in booking the stories - funny that). After years and years of watching the villains run roughshod over absolutely everyone, gloating and laughing, the whole thing just became pointless and depressing - they were '''never''' going to be defeated, and that was that. So people just changed the channel.

* [[Triple H]] has been responsible for this at times, most tellingly during 2002 - 2004, when he basically made a career of '''burying''' [[face]]s so completely that even today (coupled, it has to be said, with WWE's almost decade-long refusal to properly build new stars), WWE has an extremely small amount of top card [[face]]s, as there are so few people left for fans to take as credible threats. Granted, the [[Heel Face Revolving Door]] makes it possible to turn a top heel into a top face at the drop of a storyline, but the top heels tend to spend most of their careers as heels for a reason: they're better at it.

 

== Tabletop Games ==

** Generally averted with the Imperial Guard, easy to identify with as it consists entirely of ordinary people attempting to battle the worst monsters in the galaxy. And occasionally ''winning''. Also averted with certain [[Space Marine]] chapters, such as the Ultramarines or Salamanders.

** Especially averted with [[Ciaphas Cain]], ('''HERO OF THE IMPERIUM!''',) an Imperial Guard Commissar. Despite being a (self-declared) utterly selfish abject coward, he comes across as a pretty good guy, managing to survive and succeed in the [[Darker and Edgier/Tabletop Games|Grimdark]] galaxy though a mix of quick thinking, good luck, and good friends.

*** ''[[Mage: The Ascension]]'' was at its heart about the clash between [[Romanticism Versus Enlightenment]] where the player characters are more or less forced to avert this trope even in their [[Crapsack World]]. As awakened souls, Mages must care about ''something'' enough to be able to rework reality, and those who stop caring usually can make no further progress.

*** ''[[Changeling: The Dreaming]]'' likewise measures a character's Banality, and gaining Banality eventually erases a character entirely. One of the fastest ways to pile Banality on is to be a nihilist who doesn't care.

{{quote|'''Holden''': Not the soaring, operatic darkness of the 40K universe, but a setting so relentlessly shitty and miserable and hopeless that it becomes impossible to emotionally invest in it or care what happens to it.}}

 

== [[Video Games]] ==

* ''[[Kane and Lynch|Kane and Lynch: Dead Men]]'' was this for quite a few people. On one hand, Kane's trying to save his family. On the other hand, he's a bastard who betrays people, takes people hostage, and does generally bad things to accomplish his goals. In fact, the only reason that the bad guys captured his family was because he betrayed them and they wanted revenge. And let's not even get started on [[The Berserker|that]] [[Shoot the Hostage|crazy]] [[Jerkass|bastard]] [[Ax Crazy|Lynch]]...

* Every faction in ''[[Geneforge]]'', with the possible exception of the [[Take Over the World|Barzites]], has some supporters who'll argue in favor of it on the Internet. Every faction also has some haters who argue that the misdeeds it commits render it unworthy of power. But given that the only one that doesn't cross the [[Moral Event Horizon]] at least once is the faction of [[Wide-Eyed Idealist|Wide Eyed Idealists]] who canonically get massacred by the fourth game, this trope probably sums up the setting best.

** The sequel takes this to its logical conclusion, with Alex Mercer as the villain. The new protagonist isn't any better as far as the [[Gameplay and Story Segregation]] means he'll still eat half the population of New York before games end, but the plot tries to hamstring a sympathetic backstory for him to show [[Even Evil Has Loved Ones]] to paint him as the lesser evil out of the five or so evils running around in total. How well it works is a matter of personal taste, but since some see him as a [[Replacement Scrappy]] on top of everything else, one wonders why these games don't go full on [[Refuge in Audacity]] and have the player character deliberately be the most evil person in the conflict of all and go balls out crazy.

* ''[[Knights of the Old Republic (video game)|Knights of the Old Republic]] II: The Sith Lords'' veers into this: There's a rising theme of nihilism and futility throughout the game (in a total reversal of the original) - no matter what you do, you cannot save any of the main NPCs, or redeem any of the Sith-aligned villains. Then, in the final battle, the [[Big Bad]] reveals that {{spoiler|there was no evil plan to begin with - the whole game was just her fucking with you, none of it would have happened if you didn't exist, and if she wins, she'll commit suicide. You beat her, saving nobody but your own party, and she makes a bunch of dull prophecies about how nothing means anything,}} and then the (uninhabited) planet explodes with a massive (and never picked up, due to killing the franchise) [[Sequel Hook]]. Whee.

** A light-side Exile can still do a lot of good and help a lot of people on the way, even if your [[Trickster Mentor]] gives you hell for it. Kreia has no evil plan towards the PC because it isn't ''about'' you; she wanted to build you up as a hero to prove a philosophical point to the remaining Jedi and provide Revan with a worthy ally in his battle against the [[Star Wars: The Old Republic|True Sith]].

** The sequel essentially concedes the point to the audience and opens by nuking both sides. You can pick whether to recruit Remnant Mages or Remnant Templars as allies for your own quest to stop the latest supervillain (who is entirely unrelated to the Mage/Templar war save in the sense that he may have had an indirect hand in making it worse so that everybody would be distracted from his plots and then dropped the nuke when he didn't need it any longer), but outside of a choice of sidequests it makes no difference to the story arc.

* ''[[Fallout: New Vegas]]'' can suffer from this. Mr House is very efficient and competent, but only cares about Vegas. Caesar's Legion are an expansionist, imperialistic, brutal slave army that treats women as property. The NCR means well, but it's hamstrung by bloated bureaucracy and doesn't really ''get'' how the Mojave works. You could go Wild Card, but can you forge a Vegas that's any better than what was there before?

 

* The so-called protagonists are unrepentant and hypocritical murderers, there's no point in the people who die learning last-minute lessons and everyone else is apparently never put two and two together to figure out the protagonists commit such horrible acts and so they are never stopped. Congratulations, you just read everything wrong with ''[[Suicide for Hire]]''.

* ''[[Prequel (webcomic)|Prequel]]'''s Katia just keeps losing everything, leading to many readers quitting the strip after {{spoiler|Sigrid takes almost everything she has.}}

 

== Web Original ==

* Brought up in ''[[I'm a Marvel And I'm a DC|Marvel and DC: After Hours]]'' by [[Norman Osborn|the Green Goblin]], in which he states that [[The Joker]]'s plan to make all the superheroes [[Darker and Edgier]] [[Nineties Anti-Hero|Nineties Antiheroes]] is just plain stupid since without [[Lighter and Softer]] heroes for contrast, not only will comics get boring since all the heroes are the same, comics will just get so depressing that the audience might as well just [[Driven to Suicide|kill themselves]].

 

== Western Animation ==

* The ''[[South Park]]'' episode "Douche and Turd" involves Stan suffering a case of this, [[Serious Business|refusing to vote]] in a school mascot election owing to the fact that one is (quite literally) a giant douche and the other is a turd sandwich.

* ''[[The Critic (animation)|The Critic]]''. Reviewers wondered if the audience would have any sympathy for [[Failure Hero|Jay Sherman.]] The second season made him more of a [[The Woobie|Woobie]] and gave him a sweet girlfriend with an adorable daughter.

* In ''[[Beast Machines]]'', the planet is essentially already dead and taken over before the first episode and the protagonists are so flawed that watching them tends to provoke nihilism rather than attachment.

* ''[[Drawn Together]]'' [[Played for Laughs|play this for laughs]] amongst [[Refuge in Audacity]], but you can still grow to feel bad for the characters.

[[Category:Cynicism Tropes]]

[[Category:Audience Reactions]]

[[Category:Depressing Tropes]]